Attempting to correct sync with lemmy.world

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@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

tzafrir

@tzafrir@tooot.im

Debian (Linux, Free Software) user from Israel

דואר, XMPP ומטריקס: tzafrir@cohens.org.il

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RememberUsAlways , to palestine group
@RememberUsAlways@newsie.social avatar

To all the sympathy terrorists screaming into the void.

Your is showing.
Free the . Free .

Destroy .
Then we will have .

@palestine
@israel




tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@linuxgnome @abhijith @palestine @israel

The Irgun (Etsel) and Stern Gang (Lehi) had had very little influence at the time Israel was founded. THey were not part of the interim government.

(And if you take all the terrorist, using similar criteria, linked to the Palestinian Arab leadership, e.g. Amin al-Husseini)

faab64 , to palestine group

The Times of Israel has reported that the Israeli military detected the activation of Hamas phones using Israeli SIM cards 6 hours before the attack on October 7th.

This reporting suggests that the Israeli military had prior knowledge to the attack and most likely allowed it to happen.

@palestine @israel

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@thetechtutor @morpheo @faab64 @palestine @israel

It's a real story. The thing is, such things have already happened several times before. So it wasn't a definite red flag. However, there were also other warning signs. So a tactical team was put on the alert (although not the whole units on the border).

Some people mentioned an issue with the link, so I repeat it.

https://www.timesofisrael.com/hours-before-hamas-attack-idf-noticed-hundreds-of-terrorists-activating-israeli-sims/

But that's only half of the story. The other half is internal Israeli politics.

>>>

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@thetechtutor @morpheo @faab64 @palestine @israel

Israeli journalists knew about this esim story for quite some time. Israeli censorship asked them not to publish it as it exposes intelligence capabilities. They agreed also because it wasn't a big deal:

There were other warning signs, and this was already discussed by journalists. But somehow noone considered such a large scale attack.

So, why did this story suddenly some up?

>>>

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@thetechtutor @morpheo @faab64 @palestine @israel

Ever since Oct-7th, Netanyahu and his supporters try to shift the blame away from him in any possible way. One method is to come up with various conspiracy theories about how the "system" knew and didn't alert Netanyahu (the "all powerful savior"), or even worse: conspired with the enemies.

This is yet another part. It was "leaked" by Channel 14, the Netanyahu-supporting broadcasting news channel. And originally claimed 1000 of sim cards.

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@thetechtutor @morpheo @faab64 @palestine @israel

No. Israel should have been better prepared for such an attack. It wouldn't have taken that large a force to hold it at the border.

But that's in hindsight.

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@faab64 @morpheo @palestine @israel @thetechtutor

Nitpick; People keep mentioning Sabra and Shatila. It fueled the existing wave of protests, and eventually drove PM Begin to resign.

You somehow never hear of Karantina massacre where Christians backed by Syrian troops killed thousands of Palestinians (and sparked a chain of such attacks between Palestinians and Christians).

>>>

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@faab64 @morpheo @palestine @israel @thetechtutor

Assad never had to deal with the sparks of this. He had no problem switching sides between Palestinians and Christians in that war.

What the likes of Trump and Netanyahu learned is: "Never apologize. Never take the blame. It doesn't help you with anything".

Seeing how you react, I occasionally think that they are right.

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@morpheo @thetechtutor @faab64 @palestine @israel

"The right to exist" is so basic that is normally taken for granted. It's a basic element of sovereignty. For instance, article 51 of the United Nations Charter:

"Nothing in the present Charter shall impair the inherent right of individual or collective self-defence if an armed attack occurs against a Member of the United Nations [...]".

https://www.un.org/en/about-us/un-charter/full-text

(That charter assumed that the UN has a much more active role than it has today)

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@faab64 @morpheo @palestine @israel @thetechtutor

There are basically two problems with resolving this:

  1. Netanyahu, that insists on avoiding a Palestinian state, no matter the cost.

  2. Hamas, whose rockets have convinced the Israeli public that it's not safe to pull off from any Palestinian territory.

We need to get rid of both.

(I'm working on the former)

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@faab64 @morpheo @palestine @israel @thetechtutor

The blockade on Gaza is related to that half of the problem: the Hamas. This conflict should be resolved with the Hamas no longer controlling the Gaza Strip and with a single Palestinian entity.

Right now the existence of Hamas is the common interest of both Hamas and Netanyahu.

Orijewnal , to palestine group
@Orijewnal@mastodon.social avatar

Zionism is an Ashkenazi white supremacist project.

This is why in is inevitable.

https://youtu.be/IRAUQn904ic

@palestine @israel

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@Orijewnal @palestine @israel

I guess you really hate Ashkenazy supremacists like Ben Gvir.

(Someone learned a cool new word and tries to use it everywhere)

rad , to palestine group
@rad@todon.eu avatar

"We won’t agree in any way to this plan which actually says that the Palestinians deserve a reward for the terrible massacre they did to us: a Palestinian state whose capital is Jerusalem.

The message is that it really pays off to massacre Israeli citizens
A Palestinian state is an existential threat for the state of Israel as was proven on the 7 October"

Buddy, listen to me. October 7th is on Israel. It's your fault. And everything you just said might be reversed in your disadvantage. Just gaze upon that:

"We won’t agree in any way to this plan which actually says that the Israelis deserve a reward for the terrible massacre they did to us: an Israeli state whose capital is Jerusalem.

The message is that it really pays off to massacre of thousands of Palestinian citizens

An Israeli state is an existential threat for the peace in the Middle East as the state of Israel proved by it's numerous trespassing of international law and complete disregard for humanitarian efforts in the region."

Simply put: eat shit and die.

@palestine

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@rad @palestine

Let me rephrase that:

This is not about a reward for the Palestinians. A Palestinian state (alongside Israel) has been and is the reasonable alternative.

That said, we should not reward the Hamas for their actions.

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@rad @FloydyStu @palestine

When you're looking at a conflict, asking "who started it?" is basically like asking "what is the starting point?" Picking the one you favour makes the other side the culprit.

For instance, who started the conflict in Cyprus? According to the Greeks: the Turkish invasion. According to the Turks: Greeks in the island mishanded the turks there before that.

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@RememberUsAlways @rad @palestine @israel @FrankFrank @FloydyStu
Not just elections in Gaza: General elections in the Palestinian Authority.

But almost 20 years have past since. There were other opportunities to avoid such a conflict.

However, it was convenient for both Netanyahu and the Hamas that it was not resolved.

susurros , to palestine group
@susurros@kolektiva.social avatar

"Israel has carried out air strikes in southern Gaza’s Rafah, killing dozens, according to health officials, as Palestinians brace for a major offensive on the densely-crowded city.

"The AFP news agency reported that the strikes killed 52 people, while Reuters reported that 37 had been killed. Both outlets cited health officials in Gaza.

"The Israeli strikes hit 14 houses and three mosques in Rafah, according to Palestinian officials."

https://www.aljazeera.com/news/2024/2/12/israel-strikes-rafah-says-two-captives-freed

@palestine #Palestine #Israel #Gaza #Rafah

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@susurros @palestine

Just quoting the title of the news story you quoted: "Israel strikes Rafah, says two captives freed".

Also note that none of the Palestinian sources mention how many of those casualties were armed Hamas people guarding those hostages. And note that they were held among a densely-crowded city (i.e. human shields).

oatmeal , to israel group
@oatmeal@kolektiva.social avatar

#Israel / Ben-Gvir: “lethal force should be used against women and children approaching the fence”

During a cabinet meeting, far-right Israeli Minister of National Security Itamar Ben-Gvir clashed with #IDF Chief of Staff Herzi Halevi over rules of engagement along the #Gaza border. Ben-Gvir argued that clear directives were needed to prevent another #Hamas attack, saying lethal force should be used against women and children approaching the fence as potential militants.

The heated exchange reflects tensions between the military and the new right-wing government over policies toward Palestinians, with hawkish ministers pushing for tougher measures and clearly illegal measures, despite warnings from security officials and the international community.

#Walla [Hebrew] https://news.walla.co.il/item/3643079

@israel
@palestine
#IsraelUSAHamasWar
#BenGvir
#israelifascism

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@jhavok @oatmeal @israel @palestine

And what happened in the two weeks before Oct 7th when Israel allowed such "protests" to get near the border? It turned out that those protests were used to sabotage the border fence (plant bombs and such).

oatmeal , to israel group
@oatmeal@kolektiva.social avatar

Reminder: Israel’s next legal battle at the #ICJ will be a hearing on the UN's request to examine the legality of the occupation in the West Bank. Finally 🙄

The public hearing on the request, filed on Palestinian initiative, will take place Monday, 19 February 2024 in The Hague. An opinion is expected to be published towards the end of the year.

What it’s about:

#Wikipedia: “Legal Consequences arising from the Policies and Practices of Israel in the Occupied Palestinian Territory, including East Jerusalem” (Request for Advisory Opinion) is a proceeding in the International Court of Justice (#ICJ), stemming from a resolution adopted by the United Nations General Assembly (#UNGA) in December 2022, requesting the Court to render an advisory opinion.

The assessment among Israeli experts is that in the best case it will be decided that #Israel is severely violating the laws of occupation, and in the worst case that Israel is guilty of #apartheid or that Israel must immediately evacuate the territories.

One possibility is that the UN will adopt it, and then the Palestinians or various countries will try to promote practical steps to implement it. These steps can be far-reaching. Countries can act accordingly, and take economic and other measures against the State of Israel.

#Walla [Hebrew] https://news.walla.co.il/item/3641405

@israel
@palestine
#OccupiedWestBank

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@LukefromDC @MaxG @oatmeal @israel @palestine

So, as an added bonus, this will block Chinese trade with Europe, to the great delight of the US.

18+ whitedove , to israel group
@whitedove@leftodon.social avatar

How would you define Zionism?
How would you define anti-Zionism?
Who do you consider a Zionist?
Who do you consider an anti-Zionist?
Please also include how (or if) you identify yourself in this regard.

@israel @palestine

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@noam @israel @whitedove

This is example how the "palestine" group (removed) creates useless noise in some discussions and mabe should be avoided in them.

Sherifazuhur , to palestine group
@Sherifazuhur@sfba.social avatar

Omar kashif (Linked In):

South Africa cites eight elements of Israel’s genocide in Gaza and with statements of INTENT by Israeli officials:

............

(1) Killing, including a large proportion of 70% women and children of > than 21,110 fatalities.

(2) Serious mental and bodily harm, maiming, psychological trauma, and inhuman treatment.

(3) Forced displacement of 85% of Gazans, massive destruction of homes, villages, towns, refugee camps, entire areas, which precludes return of Gazans to their homes.

(4) Causing widespread hunger, starvation, dehydration by impeding sufficient humanitarian assistance, cutting off food, water, fuel and electricity, and destroying bakeries, mills, agricultural lands.

(5) Failing to provide and restricting adequate clothing, shelter, hygiene, sanitation, including for 1.9 million displaced.

(6) Failing to ensure the provision of medical care by direct attacks on hospitals, ambulances and killing doctors, medics and nurses.
@israel @palestine

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@argumento @dalehandyman @AutisticMumTo3 @Sherifazuhur @israel @palestine

Next time give the simple answer from Wikipedia: in Arkansas (because for every place in the world, there's a place with the same name in the US).

RememberUsAlways , to israel group
@RememberUsAlways@newsie.social avatar

"70 million digital files the Israel Defense Forces (IDF) said it had unearthed in Gaza"
@palestine
@israel




https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2024/01/07/israel-hamas-idf-us-dollars-mohammed-deif-picture-gaza/

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@Mastopoet @RememberUsAlways @argumento @palestine @israel

They surely have. For Israelis the major problem with a 2states solution has been "so, we pulled out of Gaza and soon after we got a Hamas-led state that fires more rockets at us. What happens if we ever pull out of the West Bank, with the e.g. Israeli Parliament in the range of mortar shells or anti tank missiles from Palestinian territory?

(Yes, there ways to handle that. But it's a problem)

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@Mastopoet @RememberUsAlways @argumento @palestine @israel

Again, Hamas has been a problem in 2009, when Netanyahu promised to destroy it in his election campaign. It's still a problem today.

Sure. You can blaim Netanyahu for not solving the problem, and even maybe for making it worse. Still, the problem exists. Andthe problem is the Hamas.

faab64 , to palestine group

where in the "Israel has the right to defend itself" can you find destruction of roads, streets or infrastructure of the Palestinian villages?

How can anyone justify and and support that?

This is pure evil and has absolutely no value other than destroying life of innocent Palestinians in occupied West Bank cities.

@palestine

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@faab64 @palestine

Reminder: destruction of roads is because Palestinian freedom fighters hide explosive changes under them to be detonated when the right vehicle drives there.

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@faab64 @palestine

War isn't a fair game.

Undermining roads to stall / stop attackers was a neat trick: it worked quite nicely in Jenin at the time. It turned out that there's a simple trick against it.

rat , to palestine group
@rat@ni.hil.ist avatar

@palestine

IN TEN YEARS OR SO TURNS INTO ANOTHER HELL — DUE TO THE MASSIVE PALESTINIAN REVENGE — my theory: iran and hezbollah will lead the endgame

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@rat @palestine
Just to see your point: because the latest success stories of Hezbolla: Lebanon and Syria, are such a well-functioning states, you want to make sure that there are others.

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@KarunaX @rat @palestine

Lebanon: Israel was only partially involved there (except for the very South part), except 1982-1985. Nothing compared to the Syrian involvement. Or the civil war that was running full scale even before the Syrian involvement.

And now the Hezbolla are part of what blocks any proper way out of the crisis that rocks Lebanon's economy for years (and again: Israel is only involved as a boogeyman by the Hezbolla).

Syria: likewise, basically.

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@rat @palestine

You mean: the puppies of the Baqa valley? It's been around for years. No substantial effect.

mikeblake , to israel group
@mikeblake@climatejustice.rocks avatar

with a resurgence of IOF and Zionist trolls, pivoting back and forth between genocide appolgia and genocide denial, it's worth a review of Timnit Gebru's list of common genocide denying/supporting tropes.

When you see these, sometimes it's worth the instant block:

" I don't know if the term genocide ..."

"What else would you suggest Israel do?"

"but both sides ..."

https://dair-community.social/@timnitGebru/111304572550320760

@israel
@palestine

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@whitedove @ashar @israel @palestine

The thing is, people claim that "Zionism is racist" based on some extremists. I see racists in almost every European country. Does this make them racist?

Zion wasn't just the "promised land" (by god, according to the religious texts), it was also the country that the Jews never really left and kept coming back to.

Even before the Zionist movement, Jerusalem had almost a Jewish majority, for instance.

failedLyndonLaRouchite , to palestine group

@mikeblake @israel @palestine

another idea of mine that will be ignored

if you adjust for population size, the 1200 deaths on Oct7 are 30x the size of the death toll on 9/11

can you imagine what the US would have done if 9/11 had been thirty times worse then it was ?

of course, the same argument applies to the Gazan's losses in the current war, although, afaik, very few Americans cared much about civilian deaths in afghanistan

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@failedLyndonLaRouchite @bmacDonald94 @mikeblake @israel @palestine
That said, those things can't simply be adjusted per capita.

Think of a country with 30,000 people, such as San Marino: if 3 people are murdered there, does it create the same local impact as 9/11?

3000 * (30k / 300M)

Err, got my math wrong by an order of magnitude.

oatmeal , to palestine group
@oatmeal@kolektiva.social avatar

This is what Biden should have said. Sadly he’s too involved if not complicit.
"Part of the problem in the end is 's arrogance," says a U.S. Air Force officer who has been involved in internal deliberations within the administration and discussions with his Israeli counterparts. "Even to us, in private and candid conversations, they have referred to the Hamas surprise attack and its brutality, they have invoked the , they have blamed Hamas, they have referred to 9/11 and argued the 'Never Again' justification for their unforgiving operation. The simple truth is Israel has lost the information war because it has destroyed so much, even if they can justify each individual attack."

https://www.newsweek.com/israels-war-hamas-how-many-palestinian-deaths-too-many-1851121

@israel
@palestine

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@Radixi @oatmeal @israel
From what I know, those reports were not confirmed by the Israeli side (not just Netanyahu, but also lower tanks that were actually in touch with the Egyptians).

RememberUsAlways , to israel group
@RememberUsAlways@newsie.social avatar

I think it's cute that everyone is suddenly an expert on and in but no one actually mentions the that our international rules war are founded on.





@palestine
@israel

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@KarunaX @RememberUsAlways @Karenawokekaren @israel @palestine

Hah? You mean Israel could block elections in the Gaza Strip? How exactly? You mean the Hamas was so keen on holding elections there?

Israel prevented holding elections in East Jerusalem and this was used as an excuse to avoid holding elections by those who did not want it in the first place.

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@KarunaX @RememberUsAlways @Karenawokekaren @israel @palestine

Strangely enough, last two rounds of municipal elections 2017 and 2021/2) were only held in the West Bank, and not in the Gaza Strip, as Hamas would not allow it.

Israel did not prevent those. Hamas did not formally participate in the former (only as "independents") but did participate in the latter.

rat , to israel group
@rat@ni.hil.ist avatar

THE TWO-STATE SOLUTION IS DEAD

@israel @palestine

Even as Israel bombards Gaza and tightens its control of the West Bank, politicians keep droning on about a two-state solution. Why? Well, it relieves them from actually coming up with an honest and just solution to the 75 years of ethnic cleansing, land theft, and occupation.

video/mp4

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@jargoggles @KarunaX @rat @israel @palestine
So, Netanyahu never wanted a two-states solution. in 2000 through 2008 there were negotiations between various Israeli prime ministers and Palestinian leaders (not to mention the Oslo accord before them) about just that.

But then Netanyahu came and all was stopped.

(Also due to the negotiation tactics by the Palestinian side. That didn't help)

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@KarunaX @RememberUsAlways @rhubarbsticks @rat @israel @palestine

In 1967 Israel was at was with Egypt, Jordan and Syria.

As of 1994, only Syria remained (and there were serious negotiations between Israel and Syria all through the 1990-s, at the time of Rabin, Netanyahu and Barak. In the time of Rabin, the Oslo process got a priority).

Barak also left Lebanon. But the Hezbulla kept on insisting that there's a problem there.

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@rhubarbsticks @RememberUsAlways @rat @israel @palestine

To be honest, the Palestinian Authority was not keen on holdin elections, and Israel's refusal was a useful excuse for them.

This is why there was no real international pressure on Israel to allow holding those elections there (e.g.: ignore them one way or the other) or on the Palestinians to follow through with the elections despite the problem of East Jerusalem.

jiujensu , to israel group
@jiujensu@mas.to avatar

CNN report claiming sexual violence on October 7 relied on non-credible witnesses, some with undisclosed ties to Israeli govt – Mondoweiss
https://mondoweiss.net/2023/12/cnn-report-claiming-sexual-violence-on-october-7-relied-on-non-credible-witnesses-some-with-undisclosed-ties-to-israeli-govt/

#FreePalestine #humanrights #apartheid #palestine #gaza #westbank #occupation #endtheoccupation #endaidtoisrael #endisraeliapartheid #genocide #repression #antizionist #antifacist #resistance #justice #israelhamaswar #ceasefire #fromtherivertothesea
@palestine @israel

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@jiujensu @palestine @israel
You can count on MondoWeiss to mold the facts to their own taste.

It's so sad to see people put so much effort into pretending Hamas is not that evil.

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@jiujensu @palestine @israel
And specifically, please read instead https://www.phr.org.il/en/gender-based-violence-eng/ .

oatmeal , to israel group
@oatmeal@kolektiva.social avatar

#germany German police raid homes of 17 people accused of posting antisemitic hate speech on social media

The suspects were said to have celebrated the attacks by Palestinian militant group #Hamas on Israel on Oct. 7, and were accused of spreading hate speech against Jewish people on social media, using symbols of banned terrorist organizations, dpa reported.

https://apnews.com/article/germany-bavaria-antisemitism-raids-b0a8df9cb8d14c8cf19a123370d5353f

@israel
@palestine
#IsraelHamasWar
#SocialMedia

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@littletree @jbburd @ecsd @oatmeal @israel @palestine
Hamas' actions can't be called a genocide because there was an army in its way. They did try.

jiujensu , to israel group
@jiujensu@mas.to avatar

The sweet faces of children make an incongruous accompaniment to the genocidal lyrics.
“Autumn night falls over the beach of Gaza, planes are bombing, destruction, destruction,” the children sing in angelic voices. “Within a year we will annihilate everyone, and then we will return to plow our fields.”

https://electronicintifada.net/blogs/ali-abunimah/watch-israeli-children-sing-we-will-annihilate-everyone-gaza

@palestine @israel

tzafrir ,
@tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

@jiujensu @palestine @israel
Interesting. I can easily see why it initially fooled Kan, who would not publish such things (and indeed quickly deleted it).

It is described as a remake of The Fellowship Song, a famous Israeli song from 1949. It was written one year after the war and commemorates the fallen comrades.

This song replaces it with different content.

Hebrew story from the right wing Channel 7:
https://www.inn.co.il/news/620466

jiujensu , to israel group
@jiujensu@mas.to avatar

Israel is responsible for most Oct 7 deaths, withheld that info and is justifying genocide based on suffering allegedly several 9/11s.
@palestine @israel

Wissamgaza on Instagram: Haaretz, Israel, Nov 18, 2023 A police investigation has revealed that during the Nova festival, a military helicopter targeted Hamas fighters, inadvertently striking some festival attendees as well. This development confirms the content of a circulated video suggesting that Apache helicopters were responsible for the majority of casualties among those fleeing the event. The pilots have reportedly admitted to initially firing upon all vehicles indiscriminately, unable to distinguish between those belonging to hamas and those who are civilians. Furthermore Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu has withheld information from the Israeli public regarding the Israeli army's significant role in the events of October 7th.
ALT
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    • tzafrir ,
    @tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

    @jiujensu @NadavPV @palestine @israel
    I e-read the story in Haaretz. Its source seems to be the police, after checking what happened there. The story focuses in a different issue and mentions this helicopter in one sentence.

    Following that, other stories were written in other newspapers that provided more information. Basically that helicopter got there on 11:20. Shooting and killing started at the party at around 7:00.

    >>>

    tzafrir ,
    @tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

    @jiujensu @NadavPV @palestine @israel
    Furthermore, the police clarified that in its investigation, it only checked what the police did and not what the military did (That was out of scope).

    Clarification of the police:
    https://hm-news.co.il/421152/

    Report on the results of that investigation:
    https://www.maariv.co.il/news/military/Article-1053124

    (Both are Hebrew, but I guess automatic translation would help)

    oatmeal , to Random
    @oatmeal@kolektiva.social avatar

    Visual history, Israel/Palestine 1920-1940s [pinned].

    tzafrir ,
    @tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

    @Thebratdragon @oatmeal @palestine @israel @histodons

    Besides a tiny minority, Jews were well committed to the British side in the war (and many enlisted as well). Resistance to the British was in the fringe in the initial years. In fact, the first leader of the Irgun died in Iraq fighting for the British.

    tzafrir ,
    @tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

    @Thebratdragon @johnwilsonwsws @oatmeal @palestine @israel @histodons

    Netanyahu was the deputy foreign minister. The foreign minister was David Levy. He and the Prime Minister, Shamir, did not get along well, so Shamir put Netanyahu there as a backup.

    And no, there was certainly no invading to Jordan considered. Israel once considered that in 1970 to deter the threat of a Syrian invasion (and it worked).

    tzafrir ,
    @tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

    @anantagd @Thebratdragon @oatmeal @palestine @israel @histodons

    Please point to something that is not true in what I wrote.

    tzafrir ,
    @tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

    @anantagd @Thebratdragon @oatmeal @palestine @israel @histodons

    Lechi were indeed a fringe, a tiny minority, with at most several houdred of people in 1948, as opposed to several thousands for the Irgun and roughly ten times that for the Haganah. And in 1940-42 the numbers for Lechi and for the Irgun were way smaller.

    BTW: the article has a scanning typo: "Stern" -> "Stem" as the last name of Avraham.

    tzafrir ,
    @tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

    @sammi @israel @histodons @palestine @Thebratdragon @anantagd @oatmeal
    If you know Hebrew well enough you know that the Chinese actually own the desert to the south of the country (yes, I know...)

    tzafrir ,
    @tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

    @anantagd @sammi @israel @histodons @palestine @Thebratdragon @oatmeal

    In Arabic it also sort-of works, but not as obvious.

    tzafrir ,
    @tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

    @Thebratdragon @anantagd @oatmeal @palestine @israel @histodons
    But that was not in the years of 1940-1942, "even when Britain fought to keep Germany out of the region" (as you wrote above).

    Indeed roughly in 1943 the Irgun decided it was time to fight the Brits again (under the new leadership of Begin). But the Haganah (the much larger of all) did not resume that until after the war in 1945.

    tzafrir ,
    @tzafrir@tooot.im avatar

    @Thebratdragon @anantagd @oatmeal @palestine @israel @histodons

    In 1938 Moshe Dayan was part of the British-blessed Plugot Sadeh and later of the British-commanded Special Night Squads.

    He was a low-rank commander (certainly not The commander) until 1941, when he was injured and retired temporarily until 1947.

    The British were fighting the Arab Revolt from 1936 until 1939. But not really fighting Germans until 1939 (or even 1940, if you consider actual fights).

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