als ,

Why is the answer always more murder?

Etterra ,

Her congrats Lindsey, you figured out the path to peace that I thought was a good idea (briefly) when I was a stupid teenager.

Hint: the idea of stupid and you're stupid.

KillingTimeItself ,

i mean to be fair, nuking japan was definitely one of the options. Japan during that time was smoking some good fucking shit

Strawberry ,

absolutely not

inclementimmigrant ,

How fucking Christian of him. Jesus would be sooooo fucking proud.

Etterra ,

That's because he's a performative Christian, or "Christian." He doesn't believe in anything unless it help him get ahead in life - just like most politicians and other moderate-to-high functioning psychopaths and sociopaths.

JasonDJ ,

I mean, he's not wrong, he's just an asshole. By most historians accounts, Fat Man and Little Boy caused less death than an actual war with Japan would have.

They were also retaliatory strikes after a direct attack on an American base, at the tail end of a global conflict, and we just got a new toy. The bomb was basically telling Japan to fuck off with their bullshit, and it did a pretty good job of it.

That doesn't make it the right answer, per se. Glassing the strip probably would net less death and destruction than continuing the genocide or especially allowing it to escalate more. I still have a hard time calling that "the good choice"

And what happens after the glass hardens? We all gonna be honky dory or is somebody else gonna star lobbing nukes?

inclementimmigrant ,

Um, Actually, I would hardly call it settled or that most historians agree.

https://ahf.nuclearmuseum.org/ahf/history/debate-over-bomb-annotated-bibliography/

glouriousgouda ,
@glouriousgouda@lemmy.myserv.one avatar

I can't hardly take them or anyone that tosses the xtian mythology around. Why should we? History hasn't shown us a "god". Only shifty humans arguing over imaginary friends.

Can we stop letting them in positions of power already? They obviously aren't fit for leadership or power.

nutsack ,

the policy makers of the united states of America

Tyfud , (edited )

Voted in by a generation of entitled, narcissistic boomers that were unfortunately exposed to leaded gasoline and paint at an early age, who know about as much about world history as their IQ counterparts: third graders.

ExfilBravo ,

How's the mental illness going Lindsey? oh ok.

Tyfud ,

Brain worms.

wildcardology ,

Yeah, nuke countries that can't nuke back.

KillingTimeItself ,

you figured out the entire point of nuclear weapons! Congratulations!

wildcardology ,

Well it is also used as a deterrent.

KillingTimeItself ,

that's what happens when you have two powers who have nuclear weapons. Otherwise what are they going to do, bomb you? They literally don't exist anymore.

RizzRustbolt , (edited )

Somebody got dumped.

noxy ,
@noxy@yiffit.net avatar

this sort of homophobia isn't helping.

out of all the queer guys I'm friends with, exactly zero of them have detonated nukes in response to their boyfriends breaking up with them.

so all that's left is you bashing a piece of shit, not for being a piece of shit, but because he kinda seems gay.

kindly, respectfully, fuck off with this shit.

RizzRustbolt ,

Better?

slurpeesoforion ,

I've been saying we should nuke South Carolina for years.

BuckyVanBuren ,

The US has already dropped two nukes on South Carolina.

What more do you want?

UPGRAYEDD ,

For the nukes dropped to explode? I dont think its a good idea.. but the nukes dropped accidentally didnt explode, which greatly reduces the effect.

BuckyVanBuren ,

That's true.

But the chickens didn't notice the difference.

slurpeesoforion ,

I want them to explode.

StaySquared ,

Lindsey is part of the swamp. He's a Christian Zionist, a doomsday Christian. These types of Christians want to hasten the Day of Judgement. Pretty much they're psychopaths thanks to the Scofield Reference Bible.

Emmie ,

I bet they would be off the rails no matter of the literature choices

todd_bonzalez ,

I cannot for the life of me figure out why, if you believe in Christian Mythology, even to the point of wanting Judgement Day to come during your lifetime, why you would personally take efforts that you know are going to end in mass civilian deaths.

Assuming you are right and Judgement Day is on the horizon, are you not damning yourself to the deepest pits of Hell by spending your time leading up to the Rapture ordering the slaughter of innocent people, rather than say glorifying and spreading the word of God?

I don't believe in any of it, but if I did, I sure wouldn't be advocating for mass-murder right before God shows up to judge me for the way I lived my life on Earth.

luciferofastora ,

Number one rule of Christian Narcissism: That rule was written for the others. It doesn't apply to me. I'm not doing anything wrong.

UpperBroccoli ,

I am christian because I say I am, therefor everything I do is christian and thus righteous.

StaySquared ,

I agree with you 100%. In my belief, it is God who wills when Judgement Day comes. It is not the will of a human. Christians and Zionists together think they can some how bypass the will of God.

todd_bonzalez ,

I'm getting a little tired of people using "Zionist" when they actually mean "Jew". Jews don't even have a "judgement day" or even the concept of Hell for that matter, so I quite frankly have no fucking clue what you think you are saying here...

If you have criticism of religion, go for it. If you have criticism of a nation, go for it. But one by one I keep watching people like you knock down the "criticism of Israel isn't antisemitic" house of cards by making it clear you don't see a difference between an Israel apologist and a Jew, and are just using the term "Zionists" as a placeholder for "Jews" so you can make weird blanket statements about Jews...

StaySquared , (edited )

I wasn't criticizing Jews exclusively. If I want to criticize a Jew or a group of Jews, I will. Idgaf quite frankly.

Judaism =/= Zionism. I'm criticizing the secular political ideology in which cherry picks from Judaism and incorporates it into it's political ideology. Some of the things they cherry pick when it comes to human relations.. is pretty fkin Nazi-like, who am I kidding.. worst than Nazi's treatment of their opposition. Reference the Talmud regarding gentiles.

Neturei Karta is the only Torah practicing Jews that I recognize as my brethren. Because they actually practice the teachings of the Torah. If you're a "practicing Jew" in Israel.. you're doing it wrong. Not because I say so, because your Torah says so.

Zink ,

You are giving them way too much credit. Any combination of “god wants me to” with “God works in mysterious ways” and “the will of God is 100% infallibly and unerringly good” can justify pretty much any heinous act you can think of.

Fedizen ,

I can't reinforce the idea enough that they believe god is eal and that they can trick a prophecy to being fulfilled by naming a british colony "Israel".

The biblical Israel is long gone and the current Israel is obviously a different state; you can "fulfill the prophecies" the same way by naming your dog "the kingdom of Israel"

BonesOfTheMoon ,

There's a Facebook tag group called "OP getting hammered harder than Lindsay Graham's tonsils at a truck stop" and that's what I think of when I see his name.

todd_bonzalez , (edited )

Democrats love being as homophobic as possible to stick it to a Republican.

Zink ,

There’s nothing homophobic about acknowledging that two or more enthusiastically consenting adult gentleman may jackhammer upon each others’ tonsils in the privacy of their own bedroom and/or truck stop.

I think it’s also not homophobia, and perhaps even being an ally, to point out when the people constantly trying to demonize the LGBT+ community are being hypocritical about it. And it’s not because they are gay or bi, it’s because it reveals how twisted their motivations are.

todd_bonzalez ,

That's not what happened though. Nobody called out hypocrisy. They just went straight for gay-bashing.

If you don't see the problem, you're a part of the problem.

jeffw OP ,

It also plays up the trope that any older unmarried man must secretly be gay

Vivendi ,

Counterproposal: let's nuke Lindsey

JonEFive ,

Counter-counterproposal: Let's drop Lindsey on Gaza

Emerald ,

Why would they want him?

JonEFive ,

I can't imagine they would. I'm merely suggesting that he be placed in an exit row seat on a recalled Boeing 737, fly it through their air space, at let nature take its course.

Zink ,

Tens of thousands of calories!

theotherverion ,
@theotherverion@lemmynsfw.com avatar

Hiroshima was the right decision but nuking gaza is the worst option possible.

StaySquared ,

Nope. Japan was pretty much done with the war before the U.S. decided to use them as lab rats to their nuclear bomb experiment. They were itching to use said technology with no regard to innocent lives.

theotherverion , (edited )
@theotherverion@lemmynsfw.com avatar

Definitely not. They weren't much done with the war.
Check the story of Hiroo Onoda who fought for extra 29 years after the war ended. Imagine this happening at a masa scale.

The fact they were losing does not mean they would give up.

By applying the nuclear bomb, the war was drastically shortened. If the bomb had not been used, more people would have died.

DeltaSMC ,

But fighting soldiers versus fighting civilians is completely different, isn't it? Isn't that why we're not really cool with the conflict in Gaza?

theotherverion ,
@theotherverion@lemmynsfw.com avatar

Do you think that even when you attempt to fight only soldiers, you will have zero civilian causalities?

Olgratin_Magmatoe , (edited )

If the bomb had not been used, more people would have died.

At best, there is no way to be sure of that, and at worst, it is outright false:

"Indeed, as early as 1946 the U.S. Strategic Bombing Survey, in its report Japan's Struggle to End the War, concluded that "certainly prior to 31 December 1945, and in all probability prior to 1 November 1945, Japan would have surrendered even if the atomic bombs had not been dropped, even if Russia had not entered..."

https://www.jstor.org/stable/1149003

https://ahf.nuclearmuseum.org/ahf/history/debate-over-japanese-surrender/

Regardless, killing people indiscriminately is and always will be wrong.

JonEFive ,

There's also the fact that there were no warnings. I've read some potentially conflicting accounts, but the consensus seems to be that there were no warning pamphlets dropped on Hiroshima ahead of the nuclear blast. At best, there may have been leaflets dropped that included Hiroshima amongst a list of 35 Japanese cities that could be the target of a bombing. At that time, the level of destructive capabilities were unheard of, so even seeing those leaflets, the thoughts citizens may have had is that there would be some firebombing. Destruction and death could be expected, but nothing like the complete obliteration that actually happened.

The use of atomic weapons was a demonstration of US destructive capabilities. They were a warning built of indiscriminate evil that saught only to strike fear into the eyes of anyone who would dare attack the US.

The use of atomic weapons may have legitimately reduced the number of American casualties, but I'm with you. It's impossible to know whether lives were saved beyond those of American soldiers. Many civilians perished on those days, and that is not something to be celebrated.

https://ahf.nuclearmuseum.org/ahf/key-documents/warning-leaflets/

theotherverion ,
@theotherverion@lemmynsfw.com avatar

Japan knew for a long time that they were going to lose and have not decided to surrender. Those 2 bombs definitely helped them with the decision.

Olgratin_Magmatoe ,

Japan knew for a long time that they were going to lose and have not decided to surrender.

Tough shit. That doesn't justify the killing of civilians.

Those 2 bombs definitely helped them with the decision.

This is a bad take given the evidence.

StaySquared ,

https://www.osti.gov/opennet/manhattan-project-history/Events/1945/surrender.htm

Prior to the atomic attacks on Hiroshima and Nagasaki, elements existed within the Japanese government that were trying to find a way to end the war. In June and July 1945, Japan attempted to enlist the help of the Soviet Union to serve as an intermediary in negotiations. No direct communication occurred with the United States about peace talks, but American leaders knew of these maneuvers because the United States for a long time had been intercepting and decoding many internal Japanese diplomatic communications. From these intercepts, the United States learned that some within the Japanese government advocated outright surrender. A few diplomats overseas cabled home to urge just that.

Semi_Hemi_Demigod ,
@Semi_Hemi_Demigod@lemmy.world avatar

Not just lab rats for the experiment, but examples to show the Russians what could happen if they decided to try something in Europe.

kerrigan778 , (edited )

There's really no reason to ever report on or pay attention to things Lindsay Graham says. He has no real values or stands of his own. He is a spineless jellyfish that goes with the tide wherever it allows him to keep the most power.

I have never seen any evidence of him ever voicing and sticking to an actual personal belief.

Maddier1993 ,

On the other hand, we should keep outing these Nazis whenever we can so that the decent part of society doesn't collectively forget who punched down and who punched up.

Mirshe ,

Also, social consequences are IMPORTANT for fighting fascism. Making them feel unwelcome at every table, every party, every workplace, EVERYWHERE is a time-tested and actually fairly effective way to fight the spread of fascist thought. It won't get rid of the most entrenched, the true believers - but it can help the knock-on effect of "hey maybe that guy has a real point".

TheDeepState ,

You go girl.

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