I own a Model 3 which I took delivery of back in 2020. As a car it's actually been fine - no major issues, aside from a fault with the AC which was sorted under warranty. It's been cheap to run, cheap to service (basically just tyres and other consumables like wiper blades), build quality seems perfectly fine and overall it's generally pleasant to drive.
The charging network is also fantastic and by far the most reliable one, at least here in the UK. It's now opening up to other makes of vehicles and I regularly see non-Teslas charging there.
Would I buy another one? With their current lineup, probably not. Nothing to do with Elon, douche nozzle though he certainly is. I mean, people still buy VWs (also great cars, used to own one too) and look who founded that company.
No, my issue is with the stupid cost cutting measures with removing critical physical controls from their latest cars. Moving the gear selector to the screen is absurd but at least you are (or should be) stationary when you are swiping the screen to change direction. Removing the indicator stalk however and replacing with buttons on a movable surface seems downright dangerous, especially in EU & UK where there are roundabouts everywhere and you need to be able to indicate while at half lock.
My Tesla is old enough to still have physical controls for all of those things and unless that changes I will not be getting another. I also just don't do enough miles these days to justify a new car, I'll just run this one into the ground.
To clarify, I used to do more miles (which is why I bought the car in the first place) but in the last year I've moved to working from home full-time. Still need the car for occasional errands and long trips, but obviously tyre wear is now not much of a problem.
However, given the massive amount of torque you can apply from standstill, if you drive like a hoon at all times then yes you can absolutely tear through them.
Probably also depends on a model. I've seen some Tesla cars can kill entire set of tires within 6 months. Not sure how people are driving them but that's too short.
They can all do that because all their torque is available practically at standstill, but they also all come with "chill mode" that makes the car accelerate like a regular-torque-curve economy car.
Would I buy another one? With their current lineup, probably not. Nothing to do with Elon, douche nozzle though he certainly is. I mean, people still buy VWs (also great cars, used to own one too) and look who founded that company.
Hitler actually scammed people out of money to build a factory for military vehicles. After the war, the workers in the factory started building the Beetle. So I wouldn't say Hitler founded the company, just built the factory.
Who would have known, alienating your biggest customer base (West Coast Liberals) with crazier and crazier right-wing nonsense would be a bad business decision. You'll have to pry Billybob's cold, dead hands off of his F-150.
My GF had a Tesla tow years ago, and she was undecided about renewing her lease. But then Elon took over Twitter and she began to feel embarrassed being seen in it.
tesla makes interesting cars, but i wait for the day they stop producing drive units, and start producing wheel drives. Hub motors are definitely the objectively correct solution when it comes to EVs IMO. There are so many more things you can do, and so many more options you're opened up to.
oh and they stop being proprietary garbage, perhaps one day we will get opentesla firmware, as a hack.
Nobody uses hub motors on production EVs yet as far as I'm aware due to the much higher unsprung mass this creates. That is to say it is a bunch more weight flopping around on the opposite end of the suspension from the frame. This leads to handling, ride quality and reliability issues. Rivian does at least use a 4 motor system though.
im not super familiar with it, but having skimmed the one article im willing to read about it, it seems interesting, im not entirely sure what it intends to do, but that's a fault of the article for not fucking explaining it lol.
If you have a very concise technical TL;DR that would be very appreciated. I genuinely cannot read the majority of content on the web because it has nothing of actual value to me. Reading documentation that actually explains things and technical papers has ruined me.
Shits all marketing speak primarily these days, i don't care, tell me what it is, and show me a demonstration or a diagram. Nothing more needs to be said IMO.
All I've seen of it is the marketing video that Hyundai released so I was curious if anyone had an unbiased opinion. I did show it to someone I know who works for a competitor and they felt that it seemed really promising, but I don't work in the field so I'm not sure.
ok, to be clear, im not educated in this field, but im a hyper nerd in this kind of shit, so i feel like i have some pre-existing understanding here.
notably, this is a take on planetary gear sets, which are notoriously, gear sets. They're fine. There's nothing weird about them, except for the fact that they reduce on an axial measure, which is really weird but super useful for things like wind turbines.
Functionally, it's pretty clever, the vertical motion is obviously useful, the side to side deflection is also going to be pretty important because nothing is perfectly rigid. I'm curious to know how maintenance is going to go, it might be a bit of a nightmare. I assume it's not that bad though, probably easier than a transmission. Which we no longer have in an EV.
If it can be made in volume, reliably, and for a reasonable price, this is definitely the future. Yeah, i mean really my only concern would be maintaining it. Which im guessing it's just an enclosed gearset in an oil bath, so probably pretty trivial. Just replace the oil every so often (or as per every modern vehicle, throw it out and replace every 100,000 miles or so)
Curious how they're going to seal the enclosure to the environments though, probably a boot, im sure that's going to be equally as problematic as every CV boot ever has always been so nothing new there really.
Thanks for the insight! My uninformed view was that from a moving parts perspective it was a lot fewer than a transmission and traditional drivetrain, so it seemed like there would be fewer points of failure and less complicated maintenance. It also seemed easy to produce, even with tight tolerances it's pretty mechanically simple.
It was hard for me to see if it was just marketing hype though. It's interesting that wind turbines use planetary gear sets! I never thought about it before beyond "wind spin blade= electricity."
oh yeah no, it's vastly simpler than an ICE engine,a clutch ,a transmission, a transfer case, the drivetrain, the differentials, and then the CV joints to the wheels.
It's certainly going to be easier to access than that whole drivetrain, that's for sure. And if you lose the proverbial first gear here, you still have 1-3 other motors taking up the slack.
wind turbines are pretty interesting, it makes sense that they use planetary sets though. It simplifies construction, and minimizes the surface area facing the wind (more power generation) There's a lot of weird things you can do with planetary sets. The two speed transmission in a drill for example? That's a planetary set, where the speed setting just locks a ring gear set to it's planets and sun gear. Thus nullifying a stage of reduction, I.E. giving you go fast speed. And then unlocking it gives you another set of reduction, I.E. slow speed for more torque.
like i said, if they can tackle the fundamentals there, which seem very possible to me. This is definitely how this stuff is going to work in the future.
I just bought my first EV and he's precisely why I didn't even consider a Tesla when it came down to it. Also it helps that I want buttons on my dash and not all screen. Ended up with a Hyundai Ioniq5, it's boss.
Leaf owner here. Same story, but I went further down market. Charging options aren't super great, but I'm getting good value out of this and a far less smug emissions than the Tesla folks. Zero regrets.
The cars never were meant to be for "Joe Average" and "Daily Family Business" but "Toys for Wanna-Be-Social-Warriors".
Too expensive, too little practical use. I would take a Mitsubishi Space Star all day over a Tesla. Even the gasoline version is more ecological friendly in the long run. They go for €7000 in the smallest version and run for DECADES with little repairs and only use 2.5 to 3.5 L/100km and have like five times more storage room than even the largest Tesla.
Tesla? No thanks.
And yes, the Space Star literally has NO computer capabilities at all. It is barely above a 1970th VW beetle. But I tell you something: I fucking don't care. It is a car, it does car things like driving and hauling, it is not an entertainment device. It is cheap, fucking robust, easy to repair, uses little fuel and lives for decades (my aunt drove her Space Star for 35 years and 250000km and it was only scrapped after my aunt died of old age). For computer stuff, navigation, entertainment I have my smart phone which I clip into a holder and have 10 times more usability than any other car computer system I have ever seen.
I see no point in paying ten times more for little gain at all.
Also pretty much any computer integration in cars I have seen are massively overpriced and often abnormal bad. The only one doing the IT stuff right are the French producers like Peugeot and Renault, they include the biggest package in all cars without additional fees and it works pretty well. All cars having the same system is a great bone because you immediately feel at home everywhere. Also they are fair priced, in comparison to a lot of American and German cars.
Btw, I have been working for BMW a lot. Even drove several prototypes for several months as a payment bone. But even when they offered me car for half the price: No thanks. I'd rather invest my money in something lasting like real estate, stocks and such.
Same goes for my family, brothers, cousins, aunts, uncles. I asked them what their expensive cars could to better and it was usually "well, it is a VW, it is a Ford, it is a whatever... and that is great" but when asked what it does BETTER... silence. Some decided to go cheap on cars after thinking about it, others decided they needed a bigger car to compensate something. Well, everyone is his lucks smith.
I don't think this is having a meaningful effect. Tesla'a biggest marketplace is China, and I doubt they care about American politics. It is more likely that China is discouraging people from buying Teslas due to American threats to ban Tiktok.
A few very vocal people here think it is a problem, but I agree, or at least that these are merely a few opinions. No facts
Personally, I loved it when Musk acted as if he were an engineer, showed his companies’ ideas with all the details. I loved it when he said he wanted to build the future many of us dreamed of, when other corporations were too caught up chasing quarterly profits to follow a long term strategy.
Then everyone started hanging on his every word, and there was no one left to tell him no …
I still recently bought a Tesla, because it was the right car for me, and I still believe in the dream for the future, that legacy manufacturers are still pushing back against. I wish the guy would shut up, but don’t care about his general opinions, unless it affects long term support for my vehicle
There are a lot of problems with him heading Tesla that aren’t related to his politics but rather his personality in general. The long history of broken promises like “In November or December of this year,, we should be able to go all the way from a parking lot in California to a parking lot in New York with no controls touched in the entire journey.” That was 2017. Or the “robotaxi” thing, which fooled a lot of people into thinking they could buy a Tesla and get it paid off by renting it out.
From our standpoint, if you fast forward a year – maybe a year and three months, but next year for sure – we’ll have over a million robotaxis on the road.”
“The fleet wakes up with an over-the-air update; that’s all it takes.”
Or more directly related to the personality he’s been displaying lately, the allegations and lawsuit about severe racism at the factory. Even if you don’t care about that, a hostile work environment does affect the quality of products..
The suit also alleges instances of racist taunts and threats, including death threats written in the bathroom and racist graffiti on “vehicles rolling off the production lines.”
Black employees who complained to supervisors about the behavior were subject to retaliation, including reassignment to unpleasant jobs, reschedulings and firings
It further charges the racial misconduct was “frequent, ongoing, inappropriate, unwelcome and occurred across all shifts, departments, and positions”.
And then there’s shoddy things like how their software is considered one of the absolute worst for privacy.
Even in a sea of privacy violators, the most valuable car maker was also the blackest of sheep. Tesla failed across all criterias of assessment—data use, data control, track record, security, and AI. It was the only carmaker that got an “untrustworthy AI” label from Mozilla.
So, Musk’s leadership is a real problem. I wouldn’t buy a car from this con artist.
I looked into this and somehow Tesla actually hold value better than other cars. Like the company’s stock price, I wouldn’t be surprised to see that change to become subpar over the next few years.
We're making our last payment on our EV this month, and a few weeks ago I brought up the idea of maybe trading it in for a newer EV, since our current one was starting to show signs of possible battery degradation and it's a Leaf that's stuck with CHAdeMO charging instead of CCS/NACS charging. My husband asked me what car we'd consider replacing it with, and the instant I floated maybe looking at a used Tesla, my husband barked back "Absolutely NOT!" And the thing was, I couldn't find myself disagreeing, either.
I know that my husband and I are far from the only ones who think the same way.
Mate what? They're saying They're gonna get an EV since their current one is degrading. Just because someone isn't getting Tesla doesn't mean They're getting an ICE. The fact is that there are other EVs now that offer better value propositions without all the baggage that comes with Tesla
Maybe for you.. Not in the US my dude. Companies work so hard to quell competition that prices are kept artificially high. I would love to have a BYD Dolphin Mini.
I'm specifically talking about the us. Its the only EV market I really track because it's the only one I'd be buying in.
Want a Tesla 3? The Ford Mach-E is cheaper and has longer range, as is also the case for the KIA EV6 and Hyundai IONIQ 5 (all with better fit and finish than the Tesla).
Interested in the Tesla Model Y? The Cadillac LYRIC gets a little less range, but its very comparable.
The only one that actually is strong in its price category is the Model S and there I'd say the Mercedes Benz EQS SUV isn't so far behind that I think you'd suffer from deep uncontrollable buyers remorse (not to mention quality control on a Merc is gonna be almost unmatched by ANY auto manufacturer)
The model x, while cheaper than the Lucid Motors Air, is no longer the all out range king. Its also MORE expensive per mile of range so I'd call it a wash. Again. All I'm saying is other vehicles offed better value propositions than Tesla, not that every Tesla offering is a bad car. If you want an EV these days it doesn't need to be a Tesla unless you really want it to be a Tesla.
Finally. The cyber truck. What can I say about the cybertruck? A lot it turns out! Fuck that vehicle. What fucking coked out moron designed that thing and what do they think trucks are for? Rivian and Ford both already have vehicles out that beat Tesla to be first to market and both have actual beds designed for actual truck stuff. The cyber truck is just a rich person toy for people who want to have a truck because trucks make them feel big and powerful but have never looked into what a truck is
Have you considered that not everyone's transportation needs, financial situation, and living arraignment are the same?aybe people live different lives with different needs because they need to. Some might live different lives because they want to.
I think it is great that this person is in a position in their life that when they needed a car, most likely 5 years ago, they were able to buy an ev, and pay it off. Good for them on the small victories in life.
I'm on vacation right now and renting a Mustang Mach-E. I never drove an EV before, but I gotta say I like it. Especially one pedal driving. I don't think I can go back to regular driving now.
My brother has a Tesla, and also a dislike of Elon. I think the important thing to remember is that Tesla is a company of many people, and they even have a specific department to wrangle the Elon and his antics. He's the "evil" attached to the capital they required to accelerate a much needed paradigm shift in American car culture. I don't think I would get a Tesla personally, not because of shit that Elon is doing, but because I have concerns about production quality, repairability, and owners rights.
My BIL got a new Tesla a few weeks ago, my dad has an older one (4 years iirc). I've driven my dad's one and I must say, I don't like it as a car and the build quality is not great. Too much fiddling with the touchscreen to get basic things done. Then I looked at my BIL's Tesla and it's a hard no now. You can't remove the stick for the indicators. It's moronic.
It's not just Elon that makes me not even consider a Tesla. He's just an extra reason to not consider the brand.
I’m another one in this camp. Had a Model 3 for five years and loved the car, but moved internationally and had to sell it. Looking at EVs again of course but uninterested in Tesla because of this guy - that and his staunch refusal to add CarPlay. What kind of a moron refuses to add phone support to a $60,000 car?
Considering that Apple in the future is going to require even tighter integration with CarPlay (including handing over control to all screens and sensors to CarPlay), which Tesla may not like.
Prosecutors described [the next generation of CarPlay] insidiously as taking “over all of the screens, sensors, and gauges in a car, forcing users to experience driving as an iPhone-centric experience if they want to use any of the features provided by CarPlay.”
And yet, hearing a legacy manufacturers version of this story from a family member who works there, my impression is Apple is taking a stand on both usability and privacy. Their stance is mostly on the data collection they will be unable to do.
I understand Lemmy has a thing against Apple, and doesn’t like some of their customer protection choices, but many of them really would be in our best interest
Tesla is actually the only car company I give a pass on this, because their software is good. Companies like GM, on the other hand, with a history of horrible software and excessive secret data collection, ditching CarPlay and claiming they can offer something better is total BS. Yeah, your “better” is h why CarPlay exists in the first place
That makes sense. But in that case, why doesn't apple impose data privacy standards on cars that want to integrate CarPlay? It would still allow car manufacturers to design their own software. I'm not sure I'd trust CarPlay to safely operate all of the sensors and displays in a car. What if the speedometer freezes for example? Or if the car suddenly detects a car in front of it (that doesn't exist) and brakes because of it? It just seems like a really bad idea to grant such levels of control of the car to CarPlay, which isn't evaluated to the same level as standard built-in car software is (afaik).
Or, better yet, Apple should lobby for comprehensive data privacy laws in the style of GDPR, which would at least help resolve these privacy issues industry-wide. And, to their credit, it seems like they are to an extent. My opinion is that hardware car functions, such as air conditioning, windshield wipers, seat warming, etc. should be managed by the car software, and navigation and music should be managed by CarPlay. Though of course opinions may differ here.
allow car manufacturers to design their own software
Maybe, but Apple is a software company; car manufacturers are not. Apple has a reputation for quality and design of software; car manufacturers do not.
Software is well outside the core competency of any car manufacturer, so I do believe it will end up being created and maintained by separate entities. Apple is taking their shot
A year ago it was a joke at my (IS) office how much I dislike Musk. Now his dickery is part of the zeitgeist and it is such a weight off my shoulders that I can stop being the only local champion of this cause.
